Sony A7 IV A7IV appears to focus on eye but focus box moves after shutter release?

[jav_eee]

Good morning,

I've been trying to figure this out for a while. Lately I've been using bird and human eye detect a lot and have noticed that the focus box does seem to be on the eye but when the pic is taken it will have shifted off to the side. I first noticed this with birds and wrote it off as the camera being tricked by the feathers but this weekend it was happening with kids. They were moving a little quick as they were running around with easter eggs but not super fast. Again though, it seemed like the camera was locked onto the eye UNTIL i pressed the shutter.

Any tips or settings I should look at for this? I was using AF-C with the tracking sensitivity set to 3 and the shutter priority set to "release".

 

[Deleted Member 5003]

Check your shooting form basics....are you introducing vibration, is your shutter speed faster than 1/shutter speed. Suggest to start here....

 

[jav_eee]

The camera is continuing to track. You don’t say if the images were in focus or not, so I don’t know if this is an image quality issue or just a question. By your description it sounds like it it was in a different location after the image was made?

Well the image was in focus on the spot where the box was. If that makes sense. If it’s right off to the side of the eye with the face being at an angle to the camera then that eye is slightly out of focus. It’s like the focus box comes off the eye when the shutter is pressed. Not always, but sometimes.

 

[jav_eee]

Check your shooting form basics....are you introducing vibration, is your shutter speed faster than 1/shutter speed. Suggest to start here....

Would my shooting form affect where the camera is focusing? I can understand blur being because of me if the box was where it was supposed to be, like the eye. But my issue is the focus box not being on the eye when the shutter is released despite it being on the eye before I pressed the shutter.

Now that I’m thinking about it maybe the focus box is exactly where it was when it focused on the eye but the subject moved right when I pressed the shutter.

 

[jav_eee]

Your last paragraph is exactly what I was thinking. I can see how form could affect this, you should still be physically tracking the subject along with the camera tracking. Shutter speed could be an issue, but since you star that some of the image is in focus we can probably discount that.

What lens is this? Is it third party? Some don’t focus as fast as others.

I was tracking fine, I think lol. I think shutter speed was ok. I did get good focus, it just wasn’t where it was supposed to be.

The lens I was using for the kids is the tamron 35-150. For the birds it’s the 200-600g. The birds errors happen while they’re sitting. Again though, I think it’s the camera getting tricked by the plumage.

 

[russellsnr]

I think it’s the camera getting tricked by the plumage.
Depends on the birds you are photographing, Goldfinch and Chaffinch it happens a lot.

 

[jav_eee]

But it shouldn’t be getting tricked. Bad to hear about the Tamron, am thinking about it or the new Samyang version. I hate to recommend this, but have you tried a factory reset?

Don’t let this dissuade you from the tamron. It’s an excellent lens. Focuses fast, sharp pics wide open.

Here’s one at 89mm, f2.8, iso100 1/640 (camera chose that speed)

 

[Gaz]

I took this shot this morning on A7iv. The focus box was present so the little eye detect box was not. Consequence is, eye not in focus in either frame. On this lens at that distance it was difficult to see for myself through the viewfinder. If the little eye detect box is lit up, then at least some of the frames are in focus.

Which brings me to the frame mode. I had it set on H instead of H+, so the bird shifts out of focus between frames. When the mechanical shutter is released this camera loses contact for 1/2000 of a second. Enough for the swallow to get away. On H, I only got 3 frames.

• ILCE-7M4
• FE 85mm F1.8
• 85.0 mm
• ƒ/1.8
• 7915/39575001 sec
• ISO 125

• ILCE-7M4
• FE 85mm F1.8
• 85.0 mm
• ƒ/1.8
• 7915/39575001 sec
• ISO 125

Also, if I’d reduced the aperture, the shots might have been entirely successful.

As for the highlighted focus area shifting off to the side, I get the problem too, so release/reset the tracking, then refocus. I’ve got tracking set to 1 but that still happens. I haven’t figured out why but I thought it was the camera remembering the first thing I focused on before I actually chose a subject. Let’s test the problem some more.

Also, which tracking do you use? I’m using focus area | trackingZone but haven’t worked out what suits me best.
Gaz

 

[spudhead]

I am not going to be much help here but I just question why so many people are obsessed with eye focus, too many people on here and other sites assume it is the thing to use why? why focus on the smallest part of the bird , so many shots on sites this included are rarely partly or completely in focus, if you get good focus on the bird 90% of the time the eye will be in focus job done, learn the basics and the you can play with the gimmicks latter

 

[Gaz]

I am not going to be much help here but I just question why so many people are obsessed with eye focus, too many people on here and other sites assume it is the thing to use why? why focus on the smallest part of the bird , so many shots on sites this included are rarely partly or completely in focus, if you get good focus on the bird 90% of the time the eye will be in focus job done, learn the basics and the you can play with the gimmicks latter

I appreciate what you’re saying. The “eye focus” and “tracking” are features that Sony have touted to encourage people like me to upgrade by 12 year old Pentax K7. Until purchasing a Sony camera I’ve never bothered to attempt capturing a bird in flight because the chances of it being in focus at all are too slim. I did photograph a cricket ball hitting an English batsman in the face at the SCG, but that at least was predictable.

If I’m spending thousands of dollars to jump ship, the promised technology had better actually work.

That’s what the enquirer wants to know.

 

[spudhead]

I appreciate what you’re saying. The “eye focus” and “tracking” are features that Sony have touted to encourage people like me to upgrade by 12 year old Pentax K7. Until purchasing a Sony camera I’ve never bothered to attempt capturing a bird in flight because the chances of it being in focus at all are too slim. I did photograph a cricket ball hitting an English batsman in the face at the SCG, but that at least was predictable.

If I’m spending thousands of dollars to jump ship, the promised technology had better actually work.

That’s what the enquirer wants to know.

Ok so I am confident that you and everyone on here can capture a bird in flight in focus without eye focus, it was not a dig at anyone, it just there are several threads with people stating issues with eye focus, so you use it I guess so does it work in your opinion? oh and I do not care about cricket its like watching paint dry

 

[spudhead]

It pretty much comes down to what Gaz said. If you promise bird eye focus, you should deliver. I’ve not had any issues with it myself, but bird shots for me are a filler to keep interest during the winter months, or the occasional grab shot. I don’t put much effort into it because it’s not my shtick.

Ok so do people buy a camera just for the promise of eye focus?

 

[jav_eee]

Gaz said something that reminded me. The fast burst rates only use the first focus point, the camera doesn’t refocus for the subsequent shots. What burst rate are you using?

Usually on continuos hi, not hi+ (i think) but i only take single pics usually. At least I think i do. I'll need to verify this with more use.

 

[jav_eee]

I am not going to be much help here but I just question why so many people are obsessed with eye focus, too many people on here and other sites assume it is the thing to use why? why focus on the smallest part of the bird , so many shots on sites this included are rarely partly or completely in focus, if you get good focus on the bird 90% of the time the eye will be in focus job done, learn the basics and the you can play with the gimmicks latter

Good question. Another concern of mine is the camera never favors the closest eye (on humans), as in the example i posted up above. Reviewing that shot in camera the focus box was on the eye that was farther back. I know there's a button to change which eye it focuses on but with kids running around its... tricky.

 

[jav_eee]

Ok so do people buy a camera just for the promise of eye focus?

I did.

 

[spudhead]

Good morning,

I've been trying to figure this out for a while. Lately I've been using bird and human eye detect a lot and have noticed that the focus box does seem to be on the eye but when the pic is taken it will have shifted off to the side. I first noticed this with birds and wrote it off as the camera being tricked by the feathers but this weekend it was happening with kids. They were moving a little quick as they were running around with easter eggs but not super fast. Again though, it seemed like the camera was locked onto the eye UNTIL i pressed the shutter.

Any tips or settings I should look at for this? I was using AF-C with the tracking sensitivity set to 3 and the shutter priority set to "release".

It is possible the answer is in the above post, shutter set to release will shoot an image even if focus is not 100%

 

[iamdlewis]

As an additional follow up to Gary you can use Sony's Imaging Edge Viewer (desktop also free) to see where the focus point was for the image, this is called Focus Frame Display. This can help you fine tune your settings.

Example:

 

[jav_eee]

It is possible the answer is in the above post, shutter set to release will shoot an image even if focus is not 100%

What would be the better setting, focus or balanced? Hmmmm

 

[spudhead]

What would be the better setting, focus or balanced? Hmmmm

focus every time in my opinion, do not be suprised if you do not get the odd shot because if the camera does not hit focus it will not take the shot, and bare in mind this is not a 100% fool proof option

 

[spudhead]

As an additional follow up to Gary you can use Sony's Imaging Edge Viewer (desktop also free) to see where the focus point was for the image, this is called Focus Frame Display. This can help you fine tune your settings.

Example:
View attachment 36331

On the a9 and a7 I have if you view the image on the rear screen and enlarge it it will show you the focus point of the shot, but I guess the a74 does the same and yes its good to know about the information you added so thanks for that

 

[iamdlewis]

What would be the better setting, focus or balanced? Hmmmm

This is were your custom settings come into play.
Focus = Good for things that are not moving much or moving slowly.
Release = Good for action and fast moving things. Basically here you are betting that the object will be within the DoF after the adjustment the camera/lens has done between the frame rate shots.
Balanced = I guess this is good for when you have no idea what could be happening. I don't really understand were someone would want to use this.

For me I use custom 2 as my BiF with and have this set to release, custom 3 is bird-in-a-tree/subject and is set to focus and custom 1 is basically default manual with set to focus. This has been the same for both my A1 and A7Riv.

 

[Gaz]

I did.

Yup. The Sony advances in AF and tracking features is why I swapped out of my K7 and a forty year collection of Pentax lenses. I waited for mirrorless to at least match my K7.

The Sony lenses are ridiculously sharp, which is a “style” so far as I’m concerned, but that style is ruined if the subjects are not pin sharp in focus, and extreme eye focus is part of the language of the style.

Put it this way, it’s like comparing impressionists to realists, but this time around, the realists are the avante guarde

 

[Gaz]

It is possible the answer is in the above post, shutter set to release will shoot an image even if focus is not 100%

Oh! That’s what that setting is for! I’ve had it on release since I got the camera. I never gave it a thought.
*I just set it to “balanced”

 

[jav_eee]

Balanced = I guess this is good for when you have no idea what could be happening. I don't really understand were someone would want to use this.

I thought i read in the user guide that sony recommends "balanced" for most situations as it give you the best, darn i have to say it again, balance...
I like your idea of tweaking it per custom use and will probably copy your settings.

 

[iamdlewis]

I thought i read in the user guide that sony recommends "balanced" for most situations as it give you the best, darn i have to say it again, balance...
I like your idea of tweaking it per custom use and will probably copy your settings.

I get the idea of balance in theory but the focusing speed of the bodies and lens is such that the movement has to be pretty significant before it starts to cause issues when set to focus. If something reaches that movement level it is probably beyond what balance is effective for.